Sunday, November 6, 2011

Delving Deeper?

So I had heard about the Delving Deeper over on the Goblinoid Games forums some time ago and it piqued my interest. From what I could tell, it was supposed to be a more direct clone of Original D&D, the old boxed set I never got a chance to play when I was a kid. I like Original Edition Characters for Labyrinth Lord, but would prefer some sort of consolidated rulebook. Swords & Wizardry Whitebox is better in presentation, but the unified save and ascending armor class annoy me. I was looking forward to Delving Deeper to correct these issues and provide a better crusty-old school gaming experience. Then I saw some sample pages on the blog and came to a realization: I already have all this crap. Ten times over I have all of this. That's not to say I think DD will be a waste of money (I'm certainly going to buy it), but I don't think it's going to really DO anything for me other than sit on a shelf. What ideas will this game provide that I don't already have in some other book? I complained a while back about retro-clones becoming too prolific and diluting their own usefulness; how many iterations of a Sleep spell or stats for Ghouls do you need? DD is going to have that stuff, just like every other edition of D&D in existence. Is there a compelling reason to play it?

For once I'll end with an open-ended question as opposed to answering it myself...

18 comments:

  1. The first thing you need to realise Brad is that every version of D&D has been built on the foundation of the original three booklets and so naturally DD is going to look very familiar to anyone who has played D&D. Even the 3.5 SRD apparently contains much that is from those original booklets (I haven't looked that closely myself).

    The "too many clones" idea is not one I subscribe to, but then to me not all clones are clones. The only "true" clones I'm aware of are OSRIC for 1e and LL for B/X. I don't know enough about Dark Dungeons to know if it's a true clone of the Rules Cyclopedia, and it remains to be seen if For Gold & Glory will be a true clone of 2e. There is no true clone of Holmes, but with only 3 levels some may ask "why bother?" S&W isn't a true clone, but is instead intended to replicate the feel of the original game.

    So, there's probably only 2 true clones, maybe three so far. All other clones are basically D&D plus someone's house rules. We believe DD will prove to be a true clone.

    While some people feel that all versions of D&D pretty much play the same, others believe each version has a distinct feel (certainly if played by the book). These latter types will find that playing DD will give them the truly original experience, how it was before the first supplement came on the scene and paved the way for what was to become the "Advanced" game. These are the people who will feel compelled to play it.

    Finally, few argue that the original 3 booklets are extremely poorly organised and therefore confusing. As such most people find it hard to come to grips with the original game. DD will make that game comprehensible to all, for a great many it will probably for the first time in the game's 37 years.

    But then if folks think all the above is just so much "meh" DD is obviously not the game for them.

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  2. This is exactly the sort of response I wanted. Thanks.

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  3. Book five of the set is what interests me the most. To my knowledge no one has attempted to clone "Underworld and Wilderness Adventures." If they can clear up that mess I'll be more then happy to pay the cover price.

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  4. AssTroDickvicus has a vested interest in DD as he is the so-called editor. If you can make a photocopy of ODD or Basic saving throw charts and if you can subtract an AAC value from 19 or 20, then you have the basics of the only thing DD does differently than SWWB. You have what you need, why spend your money on more rehash? DD is for suckers who cant download SWWB and print it.

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  5. What's wrong lardgutspizzledick? Are you sick of me deleting your troll comments on my blog, so now you're going to internet-stalk me on other blogs? Go for it matey, abuse only hurts if you respect the source and you I don't respect - a cowardly troll who oh so bravely spews hate from behind the gutless shield of anonymity. You're either a sock-puppet YDIS account or a YDIS wannabe, either way you're a sad and pathetic excuse for a man.

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  6. It is far more amusing to draw you out where you can't be hypocritical. You can't delete my comments here, AsstroDick. That must really put a bug up your ass. And you know... I could be a woman. I oculd be a transgender. You just don't know, but you'll assume and you'll show yourself for what you are... a hypocrite.

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  7. Lordofgreendrizzleshits, if you are in fact a woman lemme ask you something: do you have a computer in the kitchen? Otherwise I don't understand how you're making posts.

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  8. What's wrong lardgutspizzledick? Are you sick of me deleting your troll comments on my blog, so now you're going to internet-stalk me on other blogs? Go for it matey, abuse only hurts if you respect the source and you I don't respect - a cowardly troll who oh so bravely spews hate from behind the gutless shield of anonymity. You're either a sock-puppet YDIS account or a YDIS wannabe, either way you're a sad and pathetic excuse for a man.

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  9. Brad, if I were a woman I would be in the kitchen making a sandwich, correct? If that were the case, I'd be a talented woman able to multi-task.

    Unlike our "mate" AsstroDick who cannot control himself in the cut and paste fashion of filling up your blog comments with his moronic response. He will not address issues, which I find funny.

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  10. What's wrong lardgutspizzledick? Are you sick of me deleting your troll comments on my blog, so now you're going to internet-stalk me on other blogs? Go for it matey, abuse only hurts if you respect the source and you I don't respect - a cowardly troll who oh so bravely spews hate from behind the gutless shield of anonymity. You're either a sock-puppet YDIS account or a YDIS wannabe, either way you're a sad and pathetic excuse for a man.

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  11. You know, you have probably spent more time demonstrating your ability with cut and paste thereby demonstrating how DD was developed and edited.

    "others believe each version has a distinct feel (certainly if played by the book). These latter types will find that playing DD will give them the truly original experience"

    Why should we pay for a "feel" when all that is available on blogs or from the original itself?

    I am sure you will not be able to answer that... right "matey"? That would mean you would have to not cut and paste.

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  12. What's wrong lardgutspizzledick? Are you sick of me deleting your troll comments on my blog, so now you're going to internet-stalk me on other blogs? Go for it matey, abuse only hurts if you respect the source and you I don't respect - a cowardly troll who oh so bravely spews hate from behind the gutless shield of anonymity. You're either a sock-puppet YDIS account or a YDIS wannabe, either way you're a sad and pathetic excuse for a man.

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  13. Can't answer the question regarding "feel"? We'll take that as your final answer on Delving Dumber then. The preacher should have better press than that.

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  14. What's wrong lardgutspizzledick? Are you sick of me deleting your troll comments on my blog, so now you're going to internet-stalk me on other blogs? Go for it matey, abuse only hurts if you respect the source and you I don't respect - a cowardly troll who oh so bravely spews hate from behind the gutless shield of anonymity. You're either a sock-puppet YDIS account or a YDIS wannabe, either way you're a sad and pathetic excuse for a man.

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  15. It has been so much fun having you dance for me my little monkey. Thanks to you I have had an evening of amusement but alas my time is up. I am sure you will derive some measure of fortitude by being the last word but then a copy paste word is hardly an actual response hmm? I hope that those looking to Delving Dumber will see how one of the credited editors acts and defends against criticism. Till tomorrow my funny dancing monkey for tomorrow we shall dance again!

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  16. What's wrong lardgutspizzledick? Are you sick of me deleting your troll comments on my blog, so now you're going to internet-stalk me on other blogs? Go for it matey, abuse only hurts if you respect the source and you I don't respect - a cowardly troll who oh so bravely spews hate from behind the gutless shield of anonymity. You're either a sock-puppet YDIS account or a YDIS wannabe, either way you're a sad and pathetic excuse for a man.

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  17. >Bluskreem wrote: Book five of the set is what interests me the most. To my knowledge no one has attempted to clone "Underworld and Wilderness Adventures." If they can clear up that mess I'll be more then happy to pay the cover price.

    Well, in FO! 12 I handled the wilderness part of UW&A in the intial instalment of Champions of ZED. The Underworld rules will probably not appear untill issue 14 or so, depending on how FO! divides the instalments.

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